Embracing Love Over Fear with Freddy Jackson

Christine Gyovai (00:01)

Freddy Jackson, so glad to have you on the We Rise podcast. Thanks so much for joining us. I’ve had the delight of knowing you for a while now and just really glad to have you on today. So welcome and thanks for joining.

Freddy Jackson (00:14)

Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for reaching out and making it happen. So I appreciate it.

Christine Gyovai (00:19)

Yeah,

absolutely. So Freddy, I’m gonna in just a moment ask you to introduce yourself, but just so listeners know, Freddy has a really incredible background working in different geographies and realms and you’re in for real treat today from hearing about growing personal growth, personal resilience to how that shakes out of the community scale through working in partnership with others and urban rural scales. So really again, glad to have you on today.

Freddy, tell us a little bit about your story and about yourself. You know, what have you been up to? Yeah. And again, well.

Freddy Jackson (00:52)

You know,

I guess I’ve been up to a lot. just had some great experiences over time and.

What I’ve learned is trying to stay in purpose and next thing you know, you’ve experienced a lot of beautiful things, you know? But I’m originally from Buckingham County, small town, central Virginia. If you look right in the center of the map of Virginia, the state actually, the outline of the state, you’ll see this little ice cream cone looking thing. It goes like this and on the top it goes like this. That’s Buckingham.

Christine Gyovai (01:08)

There you are, right there, the ice cream geography.

Freddy Jackson (01:31)

Yeah,

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and very beautiful. lot of nature, rivers and streams, you know. Grew up just playing outside, playing in the dirt, just running around all day long until it got dark. But, you know, fast forward, I’m a former college athlete, former music artist, wrote a lot of songs, produced a lot of music in my day.

Freddy Jackson (01:57)

Lived on the west coast doing that for a while. Personal trainer and wellness coach of like 15 years. What else? Have some background working with youth in the city, at-risk youth. I think all of them are at risk. So just at-risk youth. Wow, a lot of things you’re making me think about it. Have an undergrad and…

Freddy Jackson (02:26)

Radio Broadcasting Journalism, Masters in Psychology, second Masters in Organizational Development and Leadership Psychology, so kind of understanding the individual human behavior and then the collective communal behavior, organizational. And founder of the Love No Ego Foundation. I created a nonprofit or founded a nonprofit. nine years next month, March 2021.

Christine Gyovai (02:48)

Congratulations on that. That’s awesome. Yeah.

Freddy Jackson (02:57)

Thank you. And with that, we mentor youth and we do motivational speaking. The whole mission is to help the youth to kind of live more from this space, their human space, while being aware of all the egotistical influences out there that’s causing that peer pressure, that’s causing that separation, that’s causing that fear, and just giving them the courage to really, really look within and be themselves.

Freddy Jackson (03:22)

So in that mentoring program we’re impacting about 21 kids right now every week. They usually stay with us two, three years. We have eight, nine mentors including myself. And we’re just out there allowing love to do what it does and want kids and young people to have a truth and to live the truth. Yeah.

Christine Gyovai (03:27)

Beautiful. From your background and story and what you’ve done, how you’ve deepened that and then what you’re doing today, really beautiful story. And I know there’s more to it than that, more threads to it than that. Freddy, can you talk a little bit about, you just mentioned separation and fear. Can you talk a little bit about what that looks like?

Freddy Jackson (03:55)

yeah.

Christine Gyovai (04:07)

a little bit more about whether you mean separation and fear within people or in the environment or how does that shake out in folks you work with.

Freddy Jackson (04:15)

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Yeah, you know, separation in general is, it’s kinda, it kinda goes against the grain of who and what we are as human beings. So let’s keep it simple. Life is quite simple, but we make it so complex. So if you keep things simple and you look at what’s been given to you, what’s been given to us, right? Okay, I’m human, okay. Now what?

Freddy Jackson (04:40)

All right, now is when we start to check boxes and things and say, you know, I’m black, I’m white, I’m this, I’m left, I’m right, I’m all of that, and just goes and goes and goes. So, know, that’s good. It’s good to align who you are with what you do. That’s great, you know, that’s awesome to do stuff in the world. That’s what we’re here for. But sometimes that doing becomes egotistical, it becomes…

Freddy Jackson (05:09)

it becomes like a pedal stool to almost be proud of separating yourself. And we’re not designed to really be that way, you know? We’re designed to, inevitably, like, we’re connected. You can’t take that back, no matter what you do. So, you you have to, I think, just surrender to that and…

Freddy Jackson (05:38)

So you can, and in surrendering, you see, you know, what’s good for you, what’s reality and what’s not good for you. But if you’re unwilling to surrender, you spend a lot of time resisting and fighting and next thing you know, you know, you’re 70 years old and you wish you would have done it differently. But so with the youth, we try to show them in a simple way in a nonprofit, we want to show them

Christine Gyovai (05:46)

100%. Yeah.

Freddy Jackson (06:08)

Reality versus what we made up We want to show them the natural versus done natural We want to show them truth versus illusion when we want to show them love versus fear love versus ego And in that seeing it and in that practice in it and it’s a curriculum designed around it They start to develop this this This personal practice

Freddy Jackson (06:37)

that can take them through challenges, through mistakes, while having a commitment to just showing up as your best self today. Like, it’s today, it’s yesterday, yesterday’s gone, sorry it’s not coming back, can’t redo it. You know, so let’s tap into the now, which is the only place you can really be.

Freddy Jackson (07:03)

And we can create tomorrow by jumping into our now and doing our best work.

Christine Gyovai (07:08)

Yeah, absolutely. So what I’m hearing is really connecting with the present moment now is where it is. Really leaning into what reality is, leaning into a sense of connection, leaning into love over fear. Can you talk a little bit about what creates the conditions for people to be able to lean into love over fear? You know, in my experience,

Freddy Jackson (07:15)

Mm-hmm.

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Yeah.

Christine Gyovai (07:37)

So as you know, I do a lot of facilitation and community engagement work kind of at the regional scale around environmental solutions and then mindfulness. And often that sense of separation in my experience, including within myself, comes from a sense of fear of not belonging. You know, at the community scale, people are like, I don’t know how to engage. I don’t know how to belong. If I put myself out there, you know, there’s a sense of…

Christine Gyovai (08:03)

of not belonging to ourselves and not belonging to community and place. And it can be tricky in a very real way for people to experience a sense of belonging depending on what their story and their lives have been like. So what are those conditions that allow people to feel a sense of safety, to be able to surrender and to live in the now in a way that is really authentic and in alignment with who they are?

Freddy Jackson (08:21)

Yeah, and on that separation, my answer to that when I responded was, yeah, as an individual, but also as connecting to the community. Like it both intertwines with the same practice, you know? So how do we create the conditions? I think if you want something, you have to be willing to be it.

Christine Gyovai (08:40)

Totally.

Freddy Jackson (08:57)

Right? So if I want love, guess what? I have to be willing to love. If I want peace, if I want to experience peace, I have to be willing to practice peace. Right? I can’t be chaotic and think, I can’t be like this chaotic being and think peace is gonna come through the door one day and tell me to relax. No, you have to be it if you want it. And then when you be it, that’s the proof that you have it.

Christine Gyovai (09:00)

Because you’re doing it. Yeah.

Freddy Jackson (09:27)

So, yeah, but we are so distracted all the time by any and everything and so many things and rightfully so, it’s nonstop messages, all day long, 24 hours a day. It’s really difficult to…

Freddy Jackson (09:47)

It can be challenging to set steel. And even when you set steel, I say set steel because that’s the one thing that I do daily that sets the foundation for me to do what I do every day or that particular day. you know, it can be challenging for people to set steel.

Freddy Jackson (10:10)

without the feeling like they have to be doing something and they blame the mind for racing. Like I thank my mind for racing. Like, thank you. I’m glad you’re working. You know, like, yeah, that’s what you’re supposed to do.

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Like, go ahead and do what you do, you know? And I try to disconnect from it. I even, if I’m too rattled, if I can’t find myself like just falling into a space of just…

Christine Gyovai (10:21)

Right? You’re doing your job. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Freddy Jackson (10:39)

trying to be peaceful and relax and meditate or whatever that might be. I’ll find myself wherever I am and say, I’m in this chair right now and I’m just too disruptive with myself. I’ll say, okay, I get up. It’s like, I act as if I step out of this space, but my body and everything’s still here. And I go across the room and I’ll sit over there and I look back at myself.

Freddy Jackson (11:07)

And then I can see how disruptive I am or… And it’s a different angle that helps me kind of more relaxed and get into the moment and practice what I need to practice at that moment. But, you know, I think that’s the number one thing. You have to create it. If you want it, you have to create the conditions for it. It’s like we don’t make our kids happy. I don’t make you happy. Nobody makes me happy.

Christine Gyovai (11:11)

Yeah, yeah, beautiful.

Freddy Jackson (11:37)

I mean to a certain degree, I mean that total happiness. It’s like if you, but if we create the environment for it to happen, then you can see it for yourself and I can see it for myself and I’ll be grateful that you helped create this environment for me and also I’ll be grateful that you’re here now. So I’m gonna love you for it, you know? So I think just creating the environment for it versus like…

Freddy Jackson (12:04)

trying to give it to someone or thinking that it’s going to come find you, it’s definitely not the way. That’s kind of like suffering.

Christine Gyovai (12:06)

So showing up, being present and creating spaces where that can happen and can flourish. You talked about some really great examples, Freddy, within yourself about how you remove your, you’re disrupting yourself when you are noticing you’re in a space that you don’t want to be in or when you’re creating the conditions for peace, for love. Can you talk a little bit more about what that’s looked like in your own life about

Freddy Jackson (12:20)

the close.

Christine Gyovai (12:43)

What’s helped you grow your own inner resilience, your own inner strength over time and what’s held it back?

Freddy Jackson (12:49)

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Yeah, well, you know, I founded this message, this mission of love, wow, I don’t think you get to a space of creation and thinking of something like that without really experiencing it.

Freddy Jackson (13:06)

Whether that’s the challenging part or the really good part the ego part of the really good love part So all those bullet points I gave you in the beginning, you know former college athlete former music artists Health and wellness coach like those industries alone and and like most industries in this country is the egos always out front Like the egos always out front. It’s like that’s what they advertise. That’s what they promote

Freddy Jackson (13:33)

You need to be first. I was walking through the airport the other day and I was just like smiling at the number of people who had paid to go to the line first, you know, like the TSA line. was like a lot of people there. It was like 10 people. And then there was two to three, including myself in the general line. And…

Freddy Jackson (13:59)

I know it’s probably more to it than what I think, why they pay for that. But I’m I’m getting there at the same time you are. I’m standing right beside you. I was just kind of analyzing and having fun with it. Why you pay that extra money? But the whole reason for saying that is that’s what we pass down to kids.

Freddy Jackson (14:24)

It’s race first to be in the lunch line. They fight to be first in this and that. The simple everyday things. So, you know, coming to this message, I just got sick of it. I just got sick of the ego always being out front. And then on top of it, here’s the kicker, like the mistakes, like the personal mistakes. Like you start to see where it comes from and…

once you start to see and kind of pay attention to those emotions and those behaviors and start ripping layers of the world off of you and you see like all the certain programming the way you’ve been thinking and what you’ve been behaving and acting and you start to just for me like I started to just quiet get quiet started to become just a little bit more quiet and I try to listen

Freddy Jackson (15:19)

You know, I try to listen more and talk less. And so when I do talk, at least it’s coming from a place where I’ve at least listened for a while. But I think that’s some of the keys because I feel like we’ve been given everything that we need to be happy and to be successful, right? Like there’s nothing else out there that’s gonna replace.

Freddy Jackson (15:48)

like the joy that you already have within, but if we don’t explore that, then how do you know? So, just kind of looking at that, like I just started to enjoy listening, like I wanted to, you know, and I just got more grateful and just in the moment, and it’s like, it’s so like, it fills your cup up so much and so fast and

Freddy Jackson (16:17)

in every single day and every moment. It’s like you barely have time, although I make time of course, to say like thank you. Like the gratitude is like spilling over so much that it’s like this moment is gone, it’s gone, it’s gone, but I’m here in this moment. And then like this one is coming. And it’s just a beautiful thing. when you’re cut, just get feels like that every day. Yeah.

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Christine Gyovai (16:27)

Absolutely. So many things. I want to come back in a moment to exploring the joy within. That’s such a powerful phrase because to some degree it takes claiming the joy within and you are just talking about the practice of gratitude. I’ve had a gratitude practice for about the last 10 years or so where I write 10 things I’m grateful for every day and it’s changed the orientation of my life. Literally, it’s changed the lens of my brain instead of the inherent negativity bias my brain has looking for saber-toothed tigers and the threat. It also helps, you know, in…

Christine Gyovai (17:28)

me keep my eyes out for things that are beautiful. But to be honest with you, there are also times where it’s hard to keep that perspective of gratitude front and center. You know, this winter has been a difficult winter for us. We’ve had some family health stuff going on. The funding, as you know, the funding landscape has changed for the work and it’s made things rocky. And so while I do firmly believe that

Christine Gyovai (17:58)

My strength is found in my struggle. It takes a while sometimes to realize that and to understand the learnings from the struggle and what comes from that. But continuing my gratitude practice keeps me coming back to some days it’s writing, I’m glad that I woke up today. I have clean air to breathe today. I have water to drink, you know, and for folks who are listening and not watching, know, I’m holding up a clean glass of water. That’s a really amazing thing that a lot of people don’t have.

Freddy Jackson (18:16)

Hmm.

Christine Gyovai (18:27)

So keeping it simple, 100 % agree, just the simplicity of what we have to be grateful for is not a toxic positivity. I’m not making myself be grateful for something. It’s an intentional practice, and it’s a joy building practice to change my orientation while still recognizing that struggle is real and difficulty is real and I can’t bypass those things. I need to feel those things fully because they’re still going to be there. They’re still going to come back up.

Freddy Jackson (18:42)

Mm-hmm.

Christine Gyovai (18:57)

But my gratitude practice has fundamentally reoriented the way I look at life. So can you talk a little bit more about exploring the joy within and what helps you grow the joy within? What does that look like in your life,

Freddy Jackson (19:02)

Yeah.

The foundation for the joy within, I feel, is nature itself. Just being out in nature, mean, are keeping it simple, like we are alive because of it. Without it, we’d be dead, okay? So that’s reality. That’s inevitable. And I like to, I have a list of like, inevitables. That means those are things that I can’t change, right?

Christine Gyovai (19:22)

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Freddy Jackson (19:45)

So I should probably work on my attitude or my perception if you want to call it or my knowledge just about those things. I should learn to accept those things that I cannot change while at the same time developing a practice about those things so I don’t have any fear about them. You know, so for example, we’re all gonna transition, we’re all gonna pass, we’re gonna, you know, whatever that process is.

Freddy Jackson (20:15)

I think about, for example, my parents. They’re getting older. Spending a little bit more time with them doing things, Wheels and all this and that, you know? And that can be a frightening thing, right? But at the same time, that’s something that I can’t change. And who says they’re gonna go before me or I’m gonna go before… Who knows? But I can’t change that. So what can I do about it?

Freddy Jackson (20:42)

So I remember a few years ago as a New Year’s resolution ritual thing, I wrote down, go to see my parents once a week. And they live in Buckingham still. I’m in Charlottesville, so it’s about an hour drive one way. But I stick pretty close to that. And even when I don’t, if I’m out town or something, I call and check in.

Freddy Jackson (21:09)

And while doing that, it stops me from sitting over in this space and looking at that inevitable that I can’t change and worry about it. I’ve become more grateful now because I’m in the practice of it. I get to see them like, my God. And then I realize how long I’ve had them. Like, wow. My friends don’t even have their parents. So that’s just one example of how

Freddy Jackson (21:39)

looking at those challenges and looking at that gratitude, looking at that positivity, when people say have a balanced life, I used to say that. I don’t say that now.

Christine Gyovai (21:54)

100%. Yep.

Freddy Jackson (21:59)

Like I want the scale of tipping. Like I want to tip it over this way, like to gratitude and love and doing the things that I want to do and that I love to do. I don’t want it balanced. I don’t want 50-50. You know, I want at minimal, know, 51-49. So, and doing that, I think it’s just really looking at what you can change versus what you can’t change.

Freddy Jackson (22:31)

and coming up with the practice to accept that, but also gives you a facilitation of some actions that combat those emotions and feelings that go with it. So that way you’re always pushing towards and becoming your best self.

Christine Gyovai (22:54)

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Yeah, that’s intention. Yeah, that intention is a big part of it. So for you personally, you’ve talked about this sum disrupting your gratitude practice, time in nature, your daily meditation practice. If you wake up one morning and you’re really struggling,

Freddy Jackson (22:57)

intention. Yes.

Christine Gyovai (23:19)

What does that day look like for you? What helps you move forward, Freddy, on those days when you wake up in a struggle?

Freddy Jackson (23:26)

Yeah, you know, I don’t mind like hijacking my schedule, if you want to call it that, or my routine. If it doesn’t work out, it doesn’t work out. Like if I’m in the midst of a difficult morning, I would totally drop everything and just, I would go for like a three mile run and just take off and run, you know.

Freddy Jackson (23:56)

You know, I like to lay out on the floor and do nothing. Just lay completely horizontal on the floor. And oftentimes I’ll set a timer and I just kind of set the timer and toss my timer somewhere across the room. That way if I end up falling asleep, like something wakes me up. You know, so.

Christine Gyovai (24:16)

You’ll still be able to get out. Yep, yep, yep.

Freddy Jackson (24:24)

You know, even a challenging morning is, it can be fun. And I have little phrases and pivot phrases, call them, pivot phrases that I can say that I’ve written down that helps me pivot. It changes direction and is strong enough to impact me when I say it and I hear it. It stops me and forces me to pivot and think in a different way and move in a different way.

Freddy Jackson (24:53)

One of those pivot phrases is this too shall pass. So no matter how much joy, how much celebration, how much this award means to me or how much the challenge is right now, how difficult it is, whatever it might be, it’s gonna pass. You know?

Christine Gyovai (24:57)

Yeah. You knew I was gonna ask you about some of those pivot phrases, so I’m glad you brought one up.

Freddy Jackson (25:19)

Yeah, I mean, whatever it is, it’s going to pass, you know? And so not that I can’t get super happy and excited about something or super sad or super low about, you know, something, but it’s going to pass. And I’m super grateful that I’m here today like it’s a brand new day. And I don’t think people understand what that means. Like for me, a brand new day is like.

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Freddy Jackson (25:48)

One you never seen before, one you’ll never see again. Right? So to me, that says, I say to myself, man, what am I going to make of this day? It’s a whole fresh one. Yeah. And I can’t get it back. I can’t get it tomorrow. It’s another one. So I tell myself that’s another pivot phrase for me. And I start to feel really good and better in that moment.

Christine Gyovai (25:51)

Here it is. Here it is, right? Right, this is it. This is it, yeah.

Freddy Jackson (26:18)

I keep it moving and that’s what it’s about.

Christine Gyovai (26:19)

mm-hmm. Yeah, beautiful. So you’ve talked about a strong foundation within your core and also the ways that you can bring yourself back, but also knowing that it is passing, the joy, the struggle, the sorrow, the happiness, they’re kind of passing states. I want to broaden in a little bit to your working community.

And I want to do that first by understanding a little bit more about what the phrase love no ego means to you. And when people ask you or might have wonderings about the ego, like is the ego bad? Is it inherently bad? Is it who I am? And talk a little bit more about that.

Freddy Jackson (27:03)

Yeah. What was the first part of that question? Community.

Christine Gyovai (27:07)

Well, I’ll come back to community, but I’d love to hear a little bit more about the love and know ego first and how are you talking about that in the folks that you’re working with? Is it a pushing away of ego? Is it a welcoming ego? Is it a both and? How do you talk about that and phrase that? And then we’ll move into more of the community stuff.

Freddy Jackson (27:10)

Yeah, absolutely. So yeah, it’s love, no ego. So we try to rid the ego, but first, of course, it’s important that we define it. So people understand like, what are we trying to get rid of? What are we trying to, what space are we trying to move into here? So love in summary, period, is everything we’re designed to do and be. You know, you can give it all these names and give it.

Freddy Jackson (27:57)

collaboration, non-conditional, unconditional, you can describe it, right? With a whole lot of great terms and adjectives, but at the end of the day, it’s everything you’re designed to do and be here on this earth, period, right? So then we look into the ego and we say the ego is overly self-centeredness and or fear. Overly self-centeredness is thinking about yourself a lot.

Freddy Jackson (28:28)

or a lot of times. We ask that you think of yourself less times. And in thinking of yourself less times doesn’t mean you think less of who you are. It actually feels pretty good to think of myself less times. Because I get out of my way, I get out of the ego’s way and I start doing for…

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Freddy Jackson (28:54)

just a collective whole and in that doing for the collective whole, that also includes myself. So I received the blessings as well. So overly self-centeredness, thinking of yourself less times without thinking less of who you are. And the fear, of course, the fear pushes you into a corner and you end up making decisions that’s not good for you. Not saying you’re not supposed to fear, it’s about recognition. It’s about recognizing it and how it’s paralyzing.

Freddy Jackson (29:26)

I always say pain is inevitable, suffering is optional. That’s another pivot phrase. Like know I’m going to experience pain, but that doesn’t mean I have to suffer. I think suffering is a choice. So in defining it, everything you’re designed to do and be here on this earth, and then the ego, like it’s the one thing that can keep you away from everything you’re designed to do and be here on this earth.

Freddy Jackson (29:53)

Because it limits, because it blocks. It blocks and limits community, connection, communication. It gets in the way of progress. And it dims your light. You’re not as vibrant. It attempts to put you in this place of specialness. It’s like, think about relationships. Say if you I got my heart broken or whatever. And then I meet you, right? And then I say, you’re beautiful, you’re nice, you’re lovely, this is cool, this is exciting. And then I start to remember my heartache and my heart pain and my past one. And I’m actually coming to you now with a little expectation for you to feel some voids here, which you have no idea about. So.

Freddy Jackson (30:52)

Even if I told you, you still truly wouldn’t have an idea about how these voids are, you know? So, you know, people allow the ego to kind of yesterday, the worry of tomorrow, fear to kind of get in the way of today to now. It’s the only place you can be. And that’s why, you know, forgiveness is so important.

Freddy Jackson (31:19)

But that’s the love, no ego. And when people say, don’t we need the ego and this and that, I’ll just beg to differ because when you’re in tune and you just have a practice about it and you’re just willing to listen, this beautiful intuitive space we’ve been given, mean, love doesn’t love tell you what to do. It doesn’t love.

Freddy Jackson (31:47)

tell you when to walk away, tells you when to embrace, tells you when to be bold, tells you when to be quiet. Like, you know, it tells me, I’m afraid to go this way, I’m not going that way because love is everything. It’s safety, it’s peace, it’s joy, it’s energy, it’s the greatest, it’s everything. It’s bold, it’s courageous. And if we listen to it, I think…

Freddy Jackson (32:14)

It tells us what to do in every moment. It’s full of knowledge, right? It’s past perception. The mind can grab things and look at it and tell you what it think it sees and try to make you believe it. But the heart and the intuition, it’s like it already knows. It already knows. And if you can kind of tap or have a practice of tapping into that knowing, and you gotta just want it. You don’t have to…

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Freddy Jackson (32:44)

Understand every aspect of being human. It’s just about do you want it? your desire for it is enough because Joining and listening and When we do all that we we answer love like this we answer it. It’s happy that we we joined and we did this Yeah

Christine Gyovai (33:01)

Talk a little bit more, Freddy, about what that has looked like for you, learning to listen, that learning to know, tapping into intuition, love, whatever you call it. What has that felt like for you in your body or how have you learned to listen to go left, go right, listen more, speak more, be bold, be quiet? What is that? Tell us a little bit more about what that shakes out like in your life.

Freddy Jackson (33:37)

Yeah.

So growing up, you know, was, I was very competitive and with sports and just, have one older sibling brother who’s 10 years older than me. So there was a lot of competition there. And as a little brother, all you want to do is beat your big brother. know, I don’t care. I don’t care what it, what it is. Like we could be dragging Kool-Aid or playing a basketball game. Like I’m going to win something.

Christine Gyovai (33:49)

I have a lot of siblings, so I understand what you mean.

Get me the Kool-Aid now.

Freddy Jackson (34:11)

You know, so but i’m very grateful for that too because it made me super competitive and I had to learn to channel that It took me a long time and it still comes up from time to time You know that that spirit or competition to where it’s unhealthy and I don’t understand like What competition is supposed to do like, you But you know that’ll come up I said that to kind of create this little segue into

Freddy Jackson (34:41)

It’s still challenging.

But moving forward and understanding, like I want what’s best for me first. Like I just want what’s best for me. Like I just wanna try to maximize this thing called being human. I wanna try it, okay? Yeah, so sometimes that’s enough to get me in a spirit and other things can contribute to it. It could be a song, it could be music. I’m always listening to music.

Freddy Jackson (35:15)

You know, I’m drinking water, I’m drinking my teas. I just feel like I’m doing the right things. know? So, I forgot where I was going with that, but that’s just a compilation of things that can really just help me develop a practice of trying to invite and create the environment and create the space for me to maximize being human.

Freddy Jackson (35:45)

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You take nature and you add it on top of that. So nature, like I said, has been a big part and it’s something very magical. I can use a lot of adjectives to describe it, but watching the sunrise, watching the sunset, you start to see the comparisons of the human spirit, the body to nature, the algorithms and…

Freddy Jackson (36:15)

the how the The melatonin and all that kicks in like it’s sun’s going down you start paying attention to all these things and It’s I know it’s difficult for some people to be patient with themselves But another pivot phrase is for me is suspended judgment

Freddy Jackson (36:42)

I wanna suspend, I’m gonna put my judgment on suspension. I used to get suspended from school. That word is like stuck. So I’m gonna use it for something more positive right now. I’m suspend some judgment and try to show up just authentically. Like try to show up and see what’s available. I think one of the best ways to…

Christine Gyovai (36:46)

Mm-hmm.

Freddy Jackson (37:11)

If anybody’s out there listening, one of the best ways to tap into that is, and tap into it successfully without being or getting too impatient is to really like take a walk. That’s movement. You can walk on a trail, you can walk by rivers, by river streams and rapids. That kinda helps me, you know?

Christine Gyovai (37:37)

Mm-hmm.

Freddy Jackson (37:40)

And you can visualize things. You can sit there by the river and do a body scan. So where the attention goes, the energy goes. If you sit here and you think about your toes for long enough, they’re going to start to tingle.

Christine Gyovai (38:02)

Yeah. Yeah.

Freddy Jackson (38:04)

You start to realize this little cool power and stuff you have within you and how you can direct this energy there, direct this energy here. And like you really have that ability and overall power to heal. And I mean, when I say heal, I mean that in every way, physically, mentally, emotionally. And even if you don’t really hit the goal, that you’re thinking, just the process and the practice alone does so much that you’re going to get the most out of it no matter what at that particular time.

Christine Gyovai (38:38)

Beautiful, beautiful. So bringing that in where the attention goes, energy flows, how does that show up in your work with community? How are you bringing your energy to community? Can you talk a little bit more about Love No Ego, the mentoring program, and what patterns you’re kind of noticing as you’re working with youth particularly over time?

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Freddy Jackson (39:16)

Yeah, so community, when I think about community, it’s one of our pillars, by the way. Spirituality, education, exercise, community. Everything that we do touches one multiple, if not all of those pillars. So when we think of community, it’s community. It’s like, think connection and collaboration, right?

Freddy Jackson (39:45)

And I can’t express this enough. It sounds very, very like cliche, but like you can’t do it without the community. Like there’s unity in community, like even in the word itself, like, you know, so when I think about community, I go straight to collaboration. Like who is here that I, we can connect with and grow something. And of course,

Freddy Jackson (40:15)

Ultimately have the impact that we want to have That’s what I think every time I go to an event, especially lately I’ve been speaking at a lot of different conferences and Speaking at these conferences. I started I start to see like the importance of collaboration like we Like guys like we got it. We got to collaborate like we really like do something, you know

Freddy Jackson (40:44)

And that’s what I’ve been kind of on the last five or six presentations, just like collaboration, so community. Community means that to me, connection and collaboration, whether that’s connecting with another mission that aligns with the youth that’s going to help us impact our youth as well as their youth, events together maybe, whatever that looks like. And then also more of the corporate world that’s out there. How can we collaborate?

Christine Gyovai (41:04)

Yeah.

Freddy Jackson (41:14)

in supporting maybe this cause and have a ROI return of investment back to you, whether that’s job placement, one of our kids are interested in your industry, whatever that might be. So we kind of look at all of it so we can maximize the people that’s involved. Okay, the kid is 16, he’s interested in engineering. Okay, here’s our heating and air company. Oh, they have engineers there.

Freddy Jackson (41:40)

Okay, we introduce them. Boom, can we form a partnership of some kind? Boom, this kid’s coming to intern for you. He’s getting the skills. He’s also still in the mentoring program, getting the emotional and socio-emotional support. So that little bubble of community right there is like how we like to do it. So you’re enjoying the journey. You’re enjoying the moment. It’s not some dreadful thing. Those days are over. Those days are over. We’re not doing things that are dreadful.

Freddy Jackson (42:10)

Like forget that, throw that out. We’re not dragging and dragging and dragging and dragging and dragging. No, we’re not putting that stuff, no, we’re not putting that stuff on ourselves or anybody else. I’d rather wait.

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Christine Gyovai (42:16)

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. No more strung out.

So I’m also hearing knowing your people, knowing the folks that you’re serving, knowing the community, knowing how people can connect to one another and bring that kind of value add. You one of the things we say at our firm, Dialogue and Design is the collective is more effective. And it takes that bringing that appreciation, bringing that knowledge, but also knowing that you’re not the pinnacle, that it is the we, it is the work.

that things happening together. Can you talk a little bit about some of the lessons that you’ve learned, Freddy, over time? When people are trying to maybe get started on this journey of creating change or working with kids or working with elders, whatever the work might be, what are some of the lessons learned that you might share with folks as they’re kind of starting?

Freddy Jackson (43:14)

Hmm.

Work harder on yourself than you do the job. Because you know, who you are and how you go about who you are is going to impact what you do. it’s crazy. it’s just, it’s, yeah, it is. And you don’t realize it until you

Christine Gyovai (43:22)

It’s crazy. It’s so foundational.

Freddy Jackson (43:46)

do it and then you see how effective you are. And you know, there was a time where I was feeling like a little guilty because I would stop my day at 11 a.m. 12 and just go get lost for the rest of the day. And I would hit up friends and say things and they’d be like, you know, what are you doing in the middle of the day? Like in the mountains, in the woods, doing cold plunges and stuff. I’m like, man, because I put in the work and I did this and did this and I’m cutting it off and

Christine Gyovai (43:59)

Right? Yep.

Freddy Jackson (44:16)

I’m going to do something, enjoy myself and restore myself. But everybody, they are where they are, it’s nothing against them. But just kind of circling back to it, it’s like I was almost feeling guilty for doing that, for working on myself. It’s like I’m supposed to just kill myself or go extremely

Freddy Jackson (44:46)

and unsafely, unhealthily into what I do and just try to do it, do it, do it, do it. And I don’t know, get money, I guess, and get things and have this sense of safety and security that traditionally we’ve been taught to do. So.

Freddy Jackson (45:12)

What was the question again?

Christine Gyovai (45:14)

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Yeah, I think you’ve answered it. The lessons learned that you had offered to others, folks who are starting out in this work. Yeah.

Freddy Jackson (45:17)

So, yeah, so work on yourself. Just as much or harder than you do on other things. Let it marinate. Like I’ve learned to let some things marinate. Just let it marinate on the stove. Let some ideas marinate. That doesn’t mean like seasonal. Some may be seasonal, you know, it takes longer.

Freddy Jackson (45:44)

But working on yourself will give you a practice that, and I think help create a lifestyle that you will enjoy. So that way, what you’re doing is not really dreadful to you.

Christine Gyovai (45:53)

Mm-hmm.

Freddy Jackson (46:06)

It’s so important that we take care of this. You know, we do our best just to give it what it needs, whether that’s, you know, spirituality, education, exercise for community, right? So let it marinate. Challenges, you know, you want to make sure you are…

Christine Gyovai (46:10)

Mm-hmm. Bringing it back.

Freddy Jackson (46:34)

I think finding a healthy balance as the executive director, founder, I think a healthy balance of when you’re trying to get the people to be on your board and your team, you’re trying to have everybody on this mission and implement it. I’ve learned to…

Freddy Jackson (46:57)

Like, have balance there. And what I mean by balance there is I like to give people a chance. But I also want those people to be go-getters. Like, I want them to want to drive change, want to drive impact, want to like truly enjoy what they’re doing and not just here to make money and things of that sort. So…

Freddy Jackson (47:25)

how do I sum that up? think in the challenge of sometimes finding those people and attracting those people and being patient to attract those people and also try to let it marinate. It’s just really all those things I’m saying that kind of play with each other because it…

Freddy Jackson (47:51)

The first part, taking care of myself, gives me the patience that I need to work on acquiring the right folks. So they all kind of intertwine with each other. And at the end of the day, I think your giving, your giving has to outweigh your desire to receive or want. I think the scale should be tipped towards giving because if not, you’re in a… scarcity place you’re in a scarcity mindset and you need to

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attain this to get this to feel that But if you’re giving which is the most one of the best feelings in the world that can cannot be replaced Your given extends like for eternity You know versus You know receiving yeah, I can have a good attitude about that and I’m grateful for this and you gave me this mug I’m very honored. Thank you and

Freddy Jackson (48:51)

That’s great, but I’m just saying spend a little bit more time over there giving because if I was always receiving Just the daily practice of that says tomorrow. I’m gonna be looking to receive something And when I don’t how am I going to feel am I going to understand that so

Christine Gyovai (48:54)

that’s yeah, something I want to come back to Freddy that you talked about is the the sense of freedom, inner freedom, freedom with your day. And there is so much of this cultural norm of grind, grind, grind until there’s nothing left of you. Give, give, give, but not in a place that you give from your heart. It’s giving until you’re empty. And the speaker, Lisa Nichols, who I love, has this phrase about giving.

Christine Gyovai (49:47)

So of course there’s the cliche of giving from your cup. It’s just this beautiful analogy of giving from your cup until it overflows into the saucer and only giving from your saucer so that your cup never empties. And I think about that a lot about over time as I used to grind and work hard and be strung out and see how when my tank is empty, like I was in a conversation with someone yesterday about empty tank vibes, like it’s a real thing.

Freddy Jackson (49:58)

Hmm… Yeah.

Christine Gyovai (50:17)

You know, when you get from empty tank vibes, like, this is probably something I should hold to myself. So the more that I give to myself, the more I take that afternoon walk or I prioritize care for myself or coming back to the present moment or coming back to being in my body. That’s so, so key. What does my body need? What is my body telling me? Making connection with…

other people. When I come back to that and I fill myself up, it gives me so much more to give from a place of realness and alignment and it’s just so much better than giving from this empty strung out cup saucer situation, which is not really that helpful. But it’s taken growing that inner sense of trust and inner sense of safety and security, which has taken years. It’s not an overnight jam.

Christine Gyovai (51:12)

You know, it’s taken a while, but as I can rest in that sense of, got this, I got myself. And then that is what allows me to be able to work in community or with others. It’s been transformative and very deeply transformative.

Freddy Jackson (51:12)

Yeah, and that’s awesome. And for people who might be listening and you’re saying like, I don’t know how I can get there. don’t, can’t walk into spaces like that, you know? I share with people, I ask them and I just let them know, like, don’t you, like for freedom, I’m thinking about freedom, like ultimate freedom.

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Freddy Jackson (51:58)

Like there’s a space within you, within all of us, that no one can get to. There’s a space within you that was given to you. Like we didn’t create ourselves now. Whatever you believe in, I know I didn’t create myself. Right? So I need to respect something higher than me that created me, right? Whatever they want to call it. But the thing is, that creator gave his creations this space.

Freddy Jackson (52:28)

And there’s nobody there but you and your creator. Your spirit, your intuition, there’s nobody there. Period.

Freddy Jackson (52:41)

And when I share that with people, it’s like, yeah, that’s believable. Yeah, I think I can understand what you’re saying. So you start to get them a little bit there. And then you let them know like, now this world that we’ve created, it can steal your awareness of that space. It can’t steal the space, it’s impossible. It’s inevitable, cannot steal it, but it can steal your awareness of it.

Freddy Jackson (53:11)

And you don’t even operate from there no more. So, okay, what’s in the way? What layers are in the way that you need to rip off so you can just get back to seeing this a little bit more than you see that? That’s the same love no ego principle. You see this love more than you see the egotistical world, right? And once you start to see that, you can start to notice.

Freddy Jackson (53:40)

which space you occupy the most throughout your day. Am I here or am I there? Am I here or am I there, you know? And people, I think, start to move towards which they know is the right space to be in. It’s the best space for them to be in. So then you get the confidence, you start getting the courage, you can walk into any room, you can talk to any person, you can be an individual.

Freddy Jackson (54:08)

You can be in the community. And I believe in the gifts and the affirmations I’ve received from just trying my best to be and stay in purpose. The affirmations that I’ve received is like right on. Stamp. Yeah, like I gave you you and you are doing your best to be that you.

Christine Gyovai (54:10)

Yeah, you’re feeling it. Mm-hmm.

Yeah, absolutely. I think it also for me has come down to, you know, to come back to community and healing. You know, I will say for me, moving from a place of strung out to a place of hopefully coming from a place of abundance and inner wellspring of well-being, if you will, has come with a lot of therapy. It’s come with a lot of friendship with people. It’s come with a lot of time in nature. You know, it’s

Christine Gyovai (55:07)

And it comes with a sense of loving those parts of myself too who have different things to say through different reasons. So for me, it hasn’t been trying to get rid of the difficulty or getting rid of the hardness. It’s been really learning to feel them and love them. So Freddy, as we get ready to wrap up today, I know there’s so many more

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threads I could easily tease out with you, but I would love to hear any other thoughts or reflections you’d love to share with folks and tell people how they can learn more about you and your work.

Freddy Jackson (55:40)

Yeah Reflection always say have the courage to be you Have the courage to be you and understand that you Might not be the you that you know the authentic you that you’re being It might be a you that you’re being because of the world and the pressures around you So that’s if that’s the case is it’s false. It’s a shield. It’s not

Freddy Jackson (56:10)

It’s not really you. So have the courage to be you, have a desire to know that you and what that you is. That is really enough. If your desire to understand that is strong, like love’s gonna answer the call. It cannot, it cannot not answer it. So I say have the courage to be you. That’s the name of our mentoring program.

Christine Gyovai (56:11)

Yeah. Love that.

Freddy Jackson (56:38)

with our youth, the CURS should be Youth Mentoring Program. How to get in touch, the nonprofit, the 501c3 is lovenoego.org. Spelled just how it sounds, L-O-V-E-N-O-E-G-O. And then there’s Mr. Love No Ego, that is me. Long story short, we were doing some workshops in schools and workshops were extended like four to eight weeks.

Christine Gyovai (56:45)

Great.

Freddy Jackson (57:09)

And after repeatedly coming back to this particular school, I was walking in, I walked by the window, going to the front door and I heard a couple of kids. They said, there goes Mr. Love No Ego. Mr. Love No Ego, that Love No Ego boy is back. And they were excited, you know, they were excited. So I was like, yeah, we must be making an impact, guys.

Christine Gyovai (57:22)

I love that.

Freddy Jackson (57:37)

So, and then they just started calling me that for the remainder of the workshop and I kind of liked it. And corporate world started calling and asking to ask about this whole love no ego thing. And I started speaking in the corporate world about ego in the workplace, how to get employees and team members to show up as the authentic selves and heart led engagement and leadership stuff like that. So I made mrlovenoego.org.

Christine Gyovai (57:40)

I love it. That’s great.

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Freddy Jackson (58:07)

But yeah, reach out and you know, we’re hiring for mentors. We’re looking for all types of collaborations and just trying to put ourself in create the spaces for love to do what it does.

Christine Gyovai (58:19)

Beautiful. Well, we’ll include those links in the show notes and episode web page. So really excited. So folks, check out love note ego.org and mrlovenoteego.org. Freddy, it’s been such a joy to have you on such wisdom and just a delightful conversation. So thanks so much for joining today. Really appreciate it.

Freddy Jackson (58:39)

Yeah, yeah, thanks for making it happen. Thank you.

Christine Gyovai (58:42)

Yeah, absolutely.

Weblinks

www.lovenoego.org

www.mrlovenoego.org/

Keywords

Freddy Jackson, personal growth, resilience, community, love, ego, gratitude, mindfulness, youth mentoring, emotional intelligence, heartache, love, intuition, personal growth, community, collaboration, self-work, giving, inner freedom, authenticity

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